This is The Write Now Podcast with Sarah Werner, Episode 81: Writing As Leadership.

Welcome to Write Now, the podcast that helps all writers, aspiring, professional, and otherwise, to find the time, energy, and courage you need to pursue your passion and write. I’m your host, Sarah Werner, and I have, for whatever reason, been in leadership positions my entire life. And it’s weird, because those of you who’ve been listening to the show forever know that I am a huge introvert, and I’m hesitant to admit this, but I’m going to go ahead and do so anyway, I’m like mildly terrified of people. But as we’re going to explore in today’s episode, leadership isn’t just one thing. It doesn’t necessarily mean standing up in front of a crowd and raising your arm into the air and giving a passionate speech about how you’re going to march forward and affect massive change.

So, okay, if that’s the kind of leader that you feel called to be, that is awesome, and you should do that. But there are others of us who are gifted with a different skill set. We’ll put it that way. And there’s a lot going on with how we become leaders. Like, I don’t necessarily think that some people are born leaders and some people are born followers. I think that leadership is a decision that you make, and maybe some people make it consciously and some people make that decision unconsciously. But as we’re going to talk about in today’s episode, leadership is an intrinsic quality of a writer. We all have the capability and the capacity to lead. It’s just discerning how we do so, and to what purpose, that I think we need to discover.

My first question for you is, do you think of yourself as a leader? Again, I talk to a lot of writers, writers who are friends, writers who write in to the show and tell me their story. I hear a lot from writers, and a lot of these writers feel a lot of uncertainty and doubt, and a lot of writers believe, as do I often, that we don’t really know what we’re doing. And when we look at people who are leaders, they always seem to, well, many of them seem to have their lives together in a way that often feels very unattainable for us. But we’re going to explore what leadership actually is today, and why it can feel so daunting, but why it is so extremely necessary for us as writers to embrace that aspect of our craft.

I’m going to make a distinction today between leaders and followers. And it’s not two different types of people. I want to make this very clear. You’re not either a leader or a follower. You’re a human being, who leads in some circumstances and follows in other circumstances. Every leader is also a follower, because we’re not experts at every single thing that we do. So, say in a writer’s group, I will go ahead and take the leadership position. I’ll facilitate the discussion. I’ll call on people. I’ll help people feel validated and seen. I’ll listen to questions. I’ll do all of that leadership stuff. But then when it comes to another avenue of life, if I’m out in a canoe or on a boat or something, where I don’t have any expertise, I am definitely a follower in that situation. I will follow instructions because I don’t know anything about boating or canoeing. If somebody tells me to put on my life jacket, I’m going to put on my life jacket. If they tell me to avoid rocks or upstream or downstream or whatever the terminology is, I’m going to listen to them because that is their area of expertise.

And I think it’s important to say that all good leaders know that they also need to be followers in some situations. It keeps us humble. It keeps us listening, and it keeps us respectful of other human beings. I want to be really clear here. When I say leader, I’m not necessarily saying this is a person who can do no evil. And when I say follower, I’m not saying, oh, this is a person who’s a sheep and has no original thoughts of their own. It’s a lot more complex than that. In fact, humans tend to be herd creatures. We tend to follow the herd, because it’s easy, and it’s something that is innate in us for our survival. We stick with the group because we’re better protected that way. We have a richer life that way. We can diversify tasks and roles and chores. We’re community creatures.

But because we need to rely on each other and live together in a community, we have a very deep fear of being ostracized, kicked out, or excommunicated from that community. And again, it’s survival. Like, yeah, you can get your feelings hurt if you’re kicked out of your group of friends. But if you are living in the wilderness with a group of people, and you get kicked out of that group and you’re left to fend for yourself, you can very easily die, because you don’t have other people protecting you and providing food and doing all of the things that people need to do for each other.

I think a lot of us need to feel safe. We need to feel loved and accepted and part of something. And often, because we don’t want to have that taken away from us, and because we don’t want to be labeled an outlier or an outsider, we choose not to lead. We choose not to take action or take a risk or to go against the majority. We’re afraid, I think, of playing big, of taking a stand, of being the first to do something or one of the first to buck a trend. How do we begin to go against or overturn a certain status quo if doing so carries the risk of alienation? It’s scary. It’s scary to stand up and speak out. It carries risk. The risk of criticism, the risk of being cast out, even risk of physical harm. Being in any sort of spotlight can be incredibly intimidating, but it’s worth it.

And honestly, you are never truly alone. You will never be truly alone. There are always other people who will share your ideology. And if you are ever ostracized from a community, there are always new ones to join or create. A little bit earlier, I said that being a leader is not intrinsically good, and being a follower is not intrinsically bad, or vice versa, but there are such things as good leaders and bad leaders. There also might be a very subtle difference between a good leader and an effective leader. Are you an effective leader if you scream at people until what you want is accomplished? I mean, yeah, that might be effective. Does it make you a good leader? Maybe not, because people won’t like you very much and they won’t willingly follow you.

What makes a good leader? And I’m especially talking about this in the context of being a writer, because as we’ll talk about, there are a lot of different ways to lead, but what makes a good leader? In my mind, a good leader is someone who people want to follow. They follow out of love and not fear. Again, both types of leaderships can be effective, but one requires coercion, and that takes a lot of energy and a lot of resources. And I think at the end of the day, it’s not as effective and it’s not as valuable as someone who leads out of love. A good leader, first and foremost, has integrity. This means simply that they do what they say they’re going to do. They follow through on their promises. This establishes trust, and trust is necessary if you are going to follow someone. If I’m out on that boat, the only reason I’m going to put on my life jacket is if I trust that the person telling me to do so has my best interests at heart, because life jackets might be uncomfortable or itchy, or it might be 700 million degrees outside, and I’m sweaty.

Good leaders are honest, they’re authentic, and they’re trustworthy. They tell the truth. Good leaders also make people feel seen, heard, and acknowledged. This is a really tricky one, because it’s very easy for a leader to talk over people, because they have power, but power is only ever granted willingly. And people need to feel validated, seen, heard, and acknowledged. A good leader not only listens to people, but truly hears them, and is able to empathize with what they’re going through. I feel like empathy is a very often overlooked leadership quality, but I think that it’s a really crucial grounding element for any leader, because it allows for connection with those being led. And again, that leads back to trust and a willingness to be led. A good leader sets an example of how to live and act responsibly and out of love. A good leader is willing to solve problems and improve the lives of those being led. A good leader provides vision and direction. A good leader understands not only how to get from point A to point B, but they understand what point B is and where it is, and maybe they can even see point C on the horizon.

Providing vision is, I think, one of the places where we as writers most excel. Writers are visionaries. We see things in the past, the present, and the future, and whether you’re writing historical fiction, whether you’re writing a memoir, or a science fiction novel, or a poem, what you’re doing is establishing a vision that we can either work toward or move away from. And this is so important in our growth as a society.

All right, I have two more elements. Well, two more really big elements to a good leader. There’s a lot of elements that leadership needs, but there’s two more I’d like to talk about. The first is that a leader is seen, and I don’t mean seen visually. I mean this person needs to have a presence. This person needs to be in public. And what I mean by that is essentially, in our role as writers, we need to be publishing. And whether that’s self publishing, traditional publishing, whether you are creating a book, whether you’re creating pamphlets, whether you are creating blog posts or tweets on Twitter, wherever it is, it doesn’t really do anyone any good if you’re writing and writing and writing, and then filing that writing away in a drawer or hiding it in a box in a closet.

Oh, and I am incredibly guilty of doing this. This is something that’s really hard for me, because again, what we talked about earlier, when you publish, when you take action, it carries risk. And that risk is scary. If I publish something that not everyone likes, I could receive criticism, I could be outcast from certain communities, and that’s a little scary to a lot of us. And there’s nothing wrong with writing just for yourself. As I’ve said in previous episodes of the Write Now podcast, we write for so many different reasons. A lot of us do simply write for ourselves. We write in a journal. We write to heal. We write about our experiences. If you want your work to contribute to society and to establish you as a leader, then you do need to let other people see what you’ve written, and in some way, to publish.

Finally, and this one’s really hard, a leader takes radical responsibility. When a leader says or does or writes or publishes something, they take responsibility, not only for what they’ve said or published, but for the way that that work affects other people. And if that work helps someone, then that’s amazing. But if that work harms someone else, then the writer needs to take responsibility for that. And it’s very, very easy for us to deflect the way that that makes us feel. It’s very easy for us to hide. It’s very easy for us to cast blame on someone or something else. If you really believe in what you’re writing and publishing, then you take radical responsibility for it. And often, radical responsibility means standing up for your work. It means sharing your work. And it also means apologizing if and when your work harms someone.

Good leaders do not pass blame. It’s always really interesting, whenever I see someone making an apology, whenever I see a leader, so maybe somebody who works for a big company or a political figure, I’m always very interested in how they react to criticism. Do they say, “I’m sorry, this is my fault, and I’m going to work hard so that it doesn’t happen again.” Or do they say, “Oh, it was my intern. They made a typo or they didn’t get approval before publishing this and it’s totally their fault. And I’m firing them. It’s their fault.” A strong leader, a good leader, takes responsibility for their actions and for the effect that their vision and their decisions have on others.

Like I said earlier, there are a lot of different ways to lead, and one of these ways is through the things that we create. And it’s really good as writers and as leaders that we ask ourselves some questions along the way, and that we really become conscious and intentional about what we’re doing, how we’re calling others to act, and what we envision as the future. I’d encourage you to ask yourself, “What are you leading?” Are you leading a movement? Are you leading social change? Are you leading by establishing a vision, either a vision we need to stay away from or a vision we need to run toward? Why are you establishing that vision? And what do you want it to accomplish?

I’d also like you to ask, “Who are you leading?” This ties into who your work is for, who your audience is, who are you going to lead, and sort of tangentially, can and will people believe in your vision, in your movements, in the change that you want to affect, and will they follow you? Will they spread your ideas? It’s also good to ask, “How are you leading?” Are you leading by example? Are you showing people how to act by acting in that way? What are you saying? What kind of words are you using? Who are you including? How are you treating other people?

I talked a little bit earlier about leading out of fear and leading out of love. And there’s such a powerful difference between the two. Someone who leads with fear and out of fear can really have a devastating effect on other people when their fear begins to spread and infect others. But someone who is leading and treating other people with love and dignity and respect, that spreads, too, and has a very different kind of effect.

I learned about the concept of servant leadership years and years ago. And I was really struck by the concept of servant leadership, because it’s sort of cemented this idea that you didn’t need to use, or harm, or talk over people in order to help move forward with your vision. You could actually serve people and lead out of love. And I think it’s interesting, because that’s what a lot of us are doing with our audiences. We’re serving them. When you write a really entertaining horror story, you’re serving your audience, you’re performing an act of service. You’re giving them a really cool experience that they’ve been looking for.

A lot of writers that I know are really shy and introverted, and maybe you see yourself in this camp, because I definitely do. But some of these people, these shy, introverted people, are some of the most powerful leaders that I know. They put forth ideas that change the world, and this is something that you can do, too. The world needs good leaders right now. And we, as writers, have the vision and the power to step up and take responsibility for our future, even when it’s hard, even when it’s risky, even when it’s scary. We have the actual and real power to make a difference.

I was thinking for a little bit while I was meditating on what I wanted to say in today’s episode of all the writers who have been leaders in my life, and this doesn’t mean that I met them in person or I attended a talk that they were giving. I simply read their books, and it helped spread their vision to me, like a really positive virus. Ideas spread when we share them. And as writers, we need to be very, very aware of what that means. We are keepers of the future. We’re creators of the future. If you’re looking for a place to start reading people who I believe are truly visionary, some of my favorites, I would start with James Baldwin, Ralph Ellison, Octavia Butler, Maya Angelou, Rita Dove, Colson Whitehead, Ta-Nehisi Coates, Nikki Giovanni, Gwendolyn Brooks. These are all people who have led through their creative work. These are all people who have led through their writing in very powerful and affecting ways. I’d encourage you to check out their work, read their books. Let me know also who your favorite writer as leader is, or if you have multiple, I’d love to hear all about them.

You can put those in the comments for today’s episode, episode number 81. If you go to the show notes for this episode out at sarahwerner.com, that’s sarahwerner.com, you can find the show notes for this episode, scroll to the bottom, and there should be a comment section. I would love to hear your comments about your favorite writers as leaders. And I would also love to hear how you see yourself as a leader and a writer. I would love to hear; I asked some questions earlier in today’s episode about what are you leading? Who are you leading? How are you leading? I would love to hear your reflections on that, because I think it’s really important for us to continue to develop our identities as writers, by taking up that radical responsibility of the change and the vision that will keep us moving forward. And yes, even, and especially, when we don’t think we know what we’re doing.

When I make this podcast, I do not make it alone. I know that I’m sitting here speaking into my little tube of foam, but there are so many people who support the work that I do here at the Write Now Podcast. These supporters include Amanda King, Amanda Dixon, Julian Vincent Thornburgh, Laurie, Leslie Manson, Michael Beckwith, Regina Calabrese, Sean Locke, Susan Geiger, Tiffany Joyner, Leslie Duncan, Maria Alejandro, and Sarah Lauzon. Thank you all so much for your generous and ongoing support. I could not create this show without you.

If you would like to support the Write Now podcast, you can do so a few different ways. You can go to my website, sarahwerner.com, and in the show notes for this episode, there should be a link that says Support the Show on Patreon. You can click that link, which will take you over to patreon.com. Alternately, you can just go straight to patreon.com, and you can find me out at patreon.com/sarahrheawerner. That’s patreon.com/sarahrheawerner, all one word. There’s lots of different levels that you can support at, which was not grammatical, but I don’t know what else to say. I guess there are lots of levels at which you can support me. Because I do, do the show on my own time, and as I used to say in earlier episodes of the show, on my own dime. I would love and appreciate your support if you are able and willing to do so.

Other ways you can support the show are to just spread the word, tell a writer who you know, who might be struggling with things. Let them know that this show exists and it’s here to help them move forward with their writing and their writing career. Yeah. I’m not always great about asking for help and for donations and stuff, because I always get the feeling that nobody wants to be sold. They don’t want to be asked for things. And so that’s just, it’s a little weird, but I am deeply, deeply, deeply appreciative of it.

One quick announcement is in order to make this show more accessible for everyone, I have started including transcripts for every episode. I’m doing those slowly, as I can create them. So, I’ve started on both ends of the chronological spectrum. I’ve done the first several episodes of the show way back from 2015, there are now full episode transcripts of each show available for episodes one through, I think I’m at about eight or 10 right now. Then I’m also working backwards. There should be full episode transcripts for this episode and then several proceeding episodes through, I think I’m still in the seventies in transcribing those.

But eventually those will meet in the middle and I will have full episode transcripts for every single episode of the show. And I really hope that that is a resource that you and others will use. In order to access them, just go to the show notes for each episode and near the bottom of the show notes page, there’ll be a grayish box that you can click that says full episode transcript, click to expand. And if you click that, you will get the full episode transcript. Enjoy using those. They’re searchable. If you ever need a spelling for something that I’m referencing or anything like that, it will all soon be available for you. Enjoy.

And with that, this has been episode 81 of the Write Now Podcast, the podcast that helps all writers, aspiring, professional, and otherwise to find the time, energy, and courage you need to pursue your passion, to follow your vision, and to write. I’m Sarah Werner, and I’m grateful for your leadership.